Football » English » ManagerZone talk

MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 24-06-2011 14:49

[WCE]
President

I guess some will have their own theory why MZ has gone through a serious decline these last years. I have my own, and present it here. Suprise suprise, I am convinced the simulator we have has played a major part in making people quit this game. The sim we have now is basically the same we got back in autumn 2008. Since then it has gotten even more random, by more boost being added to the equation, more yellow and red cards aswell. But basically it is the same sim, the same hockeyscores. The same sim that only allows you to play through a small corridor on the pitch. My view is based on the people I know in this game that has quit, all of them shared the same reason, and you can guess which one that is. And I base my view on the numbers I have fetched from mzstats.net, aswell as the general feel I have gotten by being active on the english and norwegian forum. It is true that all simulators has receive critisism, but no simulator prior to 2008 ever received this level of critisism, or even close to it. Not even the "meatwall simulator" back in 2003/2004. Romanian user civilu created a thread recently where you could vote if you felt improving the simulator should be Crews top priority or not. Around 600 users feel that the simulator should be the top priority, and 20 is feeling it shouldn't. These are numbers based on the current active usermass, and allthough polls like these should be taken with a pinch of salt, it still gives a clear idea on what people in general feel about the current simulator (even 600 to 200 would). So basically, you could say that "everyone" wanted an improved simulator instead of H2H. But still, I get the feeling Patrick consider us "nay sayers" (his words) a small group. Because I doubt he would show such a condescending tone on the forum if he knew we are everyone. Importants events on MZ: 2007: New simulator. For the first time it is possible to have predefined substitutions. This simulator is known for allowing wing-play. Many, myself included, consider this to be the best simulator in MZ history. 2008: New simulator. No more wingplay. And hockeyscores implemented. Matches ending 10-6, 6-7 etc. 3D received a major overhaul, and was probably the reason for changing the sim. 2009: New simulator. Still hockeyscores. Significantly more yellow and red cards. 2010: New design, around the same time there is a major drop in userbase across MZ. See graphs below. 2011: The simulator is tweaked by adding more boost/random to the equation. I call this Patrick's SuperBoost, as I remember he mentioned he wanted more interesting games, and he is the guy pulling the shots. These graphs are fetched from mzstats.net. And the way that page determine a user to be active, is by looking at the teams last 10 matches. If there is atleast one match that is non-league, then the team/account qualify as being active. Unfortunately these graphs don't go back to 2007. [b]England[/b] [image url=http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z190/uglesuppe/england.png] [b]USA[/b] [image url=http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z190/uglesuppe/usa.png] [b]Spain[/b] [image url=http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z190/uglesuppe/spain.png] [b]Norway[/b] [image url=http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z190/uglesuppe/norway.png] [b]Germany[/b] [image url=http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z190/uglesuppe/germany.png] [b]Australia[/b] [image url=http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z190/uglesuppe/australia.png] My intention with this thread is highlighting what is the problem with MZ today, why people quit, why new users don't stay, why many people have closed their wallets. Crew don't understand their customers anymore, Patrick erratic and aggressive tone yesterday, along with him always choosing the opposite of what the users want, clearly shows this. He doesn't play this game, and he doesn't communicate with the users. Recipe for disaster. If you have comments, or perhaps theories of your own, feel free to share them in this thread.I guess some will have their own theory why MZ has gone through a serious decline these last years. I have my own, and present it here. Suprise suprise, I am convinced the simulator we have has played a major part in making people quit this game. The sim we have now is basically the same we got back in autumn 2008. Since then it has gotten even more random, by more boost being added to the equation, more yellow and red cards aswell. But basically it is the same sim, the same hockeyscores. The same sim that only allows you to play through a small corridor on the pitch. My view is based on the people I know in this game that has quit, all of them shared the same reason, and you can guess which one that is. And I base my view on the numbers I have fetched from mzstats.net, aswell as the general feel I have gotten by being active on the english and norwegian forum. It is true that all simulators has receive critisism, but no simulator prior to 2008 ever received this level of critisism, or even close to it. Not even the "meatwall simulator" back in 2003/2004.

Romanian user civilu created a thread recently where you could vote if you felt improving the simulator should be Crews top priority or not. Around 600 users feel that the simulator should be the top priority, and 20 is feeling it shouldn't. These are numbers based on the current active usermass, and allthough polls like these should be taken with a pinch of salt, it still gives a clear idea on what people in general feel about the current simulator (even 600 to 200 would). So basically, you could say that "everyone" wanted an improved simulator instead of H2H. But still, I get the feeling Patrick consider us "nay sayers" (his words) a small group. Because I doubt he would show such a condescending tone on the forum if he knew we are everyone.

Importants events on MZ:
2007: New simulator. For the first time it is possible to have predefined substitutions. This simulator is known for allowing wing-play. Many, myself included, consider this to be the best simulator in MZ history.
2008: New simulator. No more wingplay. And hockeyscores implemented. Matches ending 10-6, 6-7 etc. 3D received a major overhaul, and was probably the reason for changing the sim.
2009: New simulator. Still hockeyscores. Significantly more yellow and red cards.
2010: New design, around the same time there is a major drop in userbase across MZ. See graphs below.
2011: The simulator is tweaked by adding more boost/random to the equation. I call this Patrick's SuperBoost, as I remember he mentioned he wanted more interesting games, and he is the guy pulling the shots.

These graphs are fetched from mzstats.net. And the way that page determine a user to be active, is by looking at the teams last 10 matches. If there is atleast one match that is non-league, then the team/account qualify as being active. Unfortunately these graphs don't go back to 2007.

England


USA


Spain


Norway


Germany


Australia


My intention with this thread is highlighting what is the problem with MZ today, why people quit, why new users don't stay, why many people have closed their wallets. Crew don't understand their customers anymore, Patrick erratic and aggressive tone yesterday, along with him always choosing the opposite of what the users want, clearly shows this. He doesn't play this game, and he doesn't communicate with the users. Recipe for disaster.

If you have comments, or perhaps theories of your own, feel free to share them in this thread.

 

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Re: MZ's downfall

By monkeefromtheashes - 24-06-2011 14:52

boring! The major drop in 2010 is the clean down of inactive team, now had you mentioned the continual drop since then.....no still boring.boring! The major drop in 2010 is the clean down of inactive team, now had you mentioned the continual drop since then.....no still boring.

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 24-06-2011 15:01

[WCE]
President

From news archive: Exciting new League Compacting! 2010-10-15 19:00:15 Try again.From news archive:
Exciting new League Compacting! 2010-10-15 19:00:15

Try again.

Re: MZ's downfall

By kingjaime - 24-06-2011 15:31

[BVB]

I can't remember what it was particularly about, but the person you mentioned has previously referred to complainants on another issue as mainly being "stressed office workers, drunks or children". Lately he's determined they whine, they're nay sayers, "there is no point listening to those who shout the loudest, or repeat that we are rubbish" and in fact managed to be the first Crew member I've ever known pick up an "*edited* removed implied swearing" badge. Pah. For me the sim is indeed an ongoing issue. I must say I personally also found the User Interface and layout change absolutely awful. I still hate it in comparison to the previous setup, which I found quite intuitive. Not only was the change bad, it was also pointless because yet again the community has a "new feature" imposed, which just about no-one asked for. The sim, the User Interface and menu layout, the astonishing unwillingness of Crew to take basically any interest in what people are asking for, their months on end of invisibility... None of which would be as bad if there wasn't such clear potential to the game. I must also say it's clearly noticeable people drift out of the game, for these sorts of reasons, so I miss seeing them around or playing them. The whole situation is boring and tiresome.I can't remember what it was particularly about, but the person you mentioned has previously referred to complainants on another issue as mainly being "stressed office workers, drunks or children". Lately he's determined they whine, they're nay sayers, "there is no point listening to those who shout the loudest, or repeat that we are rubbish" and in fact managed to be the first Crew member I've ever known pick up an "*edited* removed implied swearing" badge.

Pah.

For me the sim is indeed an ongoing issue. I must say I personally also found the User Interface and layout change absolutely awful. I still hate it in comparison to the previous setup, which I found quite intuitive. Not only was the change bad, it was also pointless because yet again the community has a "new feature" imposed, which just about no-one asked for.

The sim, the User Interface and menu layout, the astonishing unwillingness of Crew to take basically any interest in what people are asking for, their months on end of invisibility... None of which would be as bad if there wasn't such clear potential to the game. I must also say it's clearly noticeable people drift out of the game, for these sorts of reasons, so I miss seeing them around or playing them.

The whole situation is boring and tiresome.

Re: MZ's downfall

By claybone - 24-06-2011 15:56

Looks like a "coalition for implementation of the old design" is in order, the sim can wait.Looks like a "coalition for implementation of the old design" is in order, the sim can wait.

Re: MZ's downfall

By marciocha_20 - 24-06-2011 16:18

again? how many of those kind of topics i will be reading everyday? just shut the hell up and quit the game!again? how many of those kind of topics i will be reading everyday? just shut the hell up and quit the game!

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 24-06-2011 16:22

[WCE]
President

I guess this thread is a desperate attempt to catch Crews attention, before they go into their 3 month hibernation again.. Yeah Jaime, Patrick's tone on the forum lately seem quite aggressive, and doesn't quit fit the image of a CEO in action. Him being edited for implied swearing says quite a bit. Agreed, the user interface isn't very user friendly at all. More than one year after it was implemented, I have still not gotten the hang of it. Often I go "hmmmfff!" when I try to maneveur my mouse arrow horizontally across the screen, only to miss the invisible corridor and having to start over again. On the forums there were a lot of upset people when the UI was released, and many of them said they would quit. I thought it was just empty threats. But looking at the numbers, it is quite clear many did just that. New UI back in 2010, the simulator we have had since 2008, and the lack of communication from Crew, even at the admin level. All those factors are in my opinion key factors for the serious decline in users across MZ. And the decline has happened despite Crew running several "invite a friend" campaigns. @marciocha_20: No one forces you to read this thread. If you don't like it, don't read it. You see what I just did?I guess this thread is a desperate attempt to catch Crews attention, before they go into their 3 month hibernation again..

Yeah Jaime, Patrick's tone on the forum lately seem quite aggressive, and doesn't quit fit the image of a CEO in action. Him being edited for implied swearing says quite a bit.

Agreed, the user interface isn't very user friendly at all. More than one year after it was implemented, I have still not gotten the hang of it. Often I go "hmmmfff!" when I try to maneveur my mouse arrow horizontally across the screen, only to miss the invisible corridor and having to start over again. On the forums there were a lot of upset people when the UI was released, and many of them said they would quit. I thought it was just empty threats. But looking at the numbers, it is quite clear many did just that.

New UI back in 2010, the simulator we have had since 2008, and the lack of communication from Crew, even at the admin level. All those factors are in my opinion key factors for the serious decline in users across MZ. And the decline has happened despite Crew running several "invite a friend" campaigns.

@marciocha_20:
No one forces you to read this thread. If you don't like it, don't read it. You see what I just did?

Beantwortet: MZ\'s downfall

By moffdacoach - 24-06-2011 17:16

[BuLi]
President

hazinho didnt you say good bye 2 months ago? why are you still there? ** edited implied insults ** - darklinehazinho didnt you say good bye 2 months ago? why are you still there?

** edited implied insults ** - darkline

Edited: 24-06-2011 18:31
Total edits: 1

Re: MZ's downfall

By gorglbnlgnag - 24-06-2011 17:20

[Talent]

Haha! This is the hanzinho I know! Always complaining and being a **** in the ***! I say as moffdacoach... it's really about time you rage quit for good if this game is so shitty as you say.Haha! This is the hanzinho I know! Always complaining and being a **** in the ***!

I say as moffdacoach... it's really about time you rage quit for good if this game is so shitty as you say.

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 24-06-2011 17:38

[WCE]
President

Would be nice if some FA could remove the personal insults from the users above. Thanks. This is a thread for discussion, and if you have nothing better to contribute with than insults, then please leave it be.Would be nice if some FA could remove the personal insults from the users above. Thanks.

This is a thread for discussion, and if you have nothing better to contribute with than insults, then please leave it be.

Re: MZ's downfall

By psycho25 - 24-06-2011 17:46

I am not worried about any SIMs anymore because i have just sold almost of the old team...Still got a few more to sell I am worried about the financial problems that MZ are facing because of the drops in the user numbers. I just hope that they will survive and not pull the plug too soon.I am not worried about any SIMs anymore because i have just sold almost of the old team...Still got a few more to sell
I am worried about the financial problems that MZ are facing because of the drops in the user numbers.

I just hope that they will survive and not pull the plug too soon.

Re: MZ's downfall

By gorglbnlgnag - 24-06-2011 17:51

[Talent]

Personal insults? There is non whatsoever. Some people is actually tired of all the complaining. Ok! The game needs a new sim and it needs a new and better transfer market, I totally agree, but come on! You've been complaining for months, maybe years already hanzi. Isn't it about time to quit? Or at least relax for a bit? Crew needs money to develop this game, they're not magicans. So... go ahead, play H2H matches, be a club member, be a happy MZ-manager for a while and maybe one of these days crew will surprise us all.Personal insults? There is non whatsoever.

Some people is actually tired of all the complaining.
Ok! The game needs a new sim and it needs a new and better transfer market, I totally agree, but come on!
You've been complaining for months, maybe years already hanzi.
Isn't it about time to quit? Or at least relax for a bit?

Crew needs money to develop this game, they're not magicans.
So... go ahead, play H2H matches, be a club member, be a happy MZ-manager for a while and maybe one of these days crew will surprise us all.

Re: MZ's downfall

By kingjaime - 24-06-2011 17:52

[BVB]

It's apparently hard for people to understand. I hate the User Interface, I dislike the sim, I dislike that because of the UI, the sim and other things a lot of people I like are either very rarely seen or have disappeared from the game altogether. But. The game has such potential. It is like a badly injured animal, where there is a chance with the right care and attention it could be brought back to good health. It's not enjoyable as it is, it's better as it was, it has the potential to be far better than either in the future. For those who can see that, it can be very disheartening not only to not see improvement, but to sometimes see it go further downhill. There are few more stupid sentiments imo than "If you don't like it, QUIT!" That's the lame give-up option. "If you don't like it, try to do something about it!" is much better. I don't understand the seemingly aggressive defence of two things in particular (the UI and the sim) which any fool scanning the forums can much over the last year or so in particular will have noticed countless (ignored) complaints about them. Each to their own.It's apparently hard for people to understand. I hate the User Interface, I dislike the sim, I dislike that because of the UI, the sim and other things a lot of people I like are either very rarely seen or have disappeared from the game altogether.

But. The game has such potential. It is like a badly injured animal, where there is a chance with the right care and attention it could be brought back to good health. It's not enjoyable as it is, it's better as it was, it has the potential to be far better than either in the future. For those who can see that, it can be very disheartening not only to not see improvement, but to sometimes see it go further downhill.

There are few more stupid sentiments imo than "If you don't like it, QUIT!" That's the lame give-up option. "If you don't like it, try to do something about it!" is much better. I don't understand the seemingly aggressive defence of two things in particular (the UI and the sim) which any fool scanning the forums can much over the last year or so in particular will have noticed countless (ignored) complaints about them. Each to their own.

Re: MZ's downfall

By kingjaime - 24-06-2011 18:03

[BVB]

"I am worried about the financial problems that MZ are facing because of the drops in the user numbers." That is a good point. All who care about the game should be. The drop is inarguable and those people haven't left "because of the complaining", they've left because of the things complained about not being addressed."I am worried about the financial problems that MZ are facing because of the drops in the user numbers."
That is a good point. All who care about the game should be. The drop is inarguable and those people haven't left "because of the complaining", they've left because of the things complained about not being addressed.

Re: MZ's downfall

By nomercyurz - 24-06-2011 18:04

[BotP]

Don't kill MZ now, I'm only just getting together / training a half decent young team...long live MZ!Don't kill MZ now, I'm only just getting together / training a half decent young team...long live MZ!

Re: MZ\'s downfall

By ereng - 24-06-2011 18:15

1 thing I don't understand. These people who are arguing that the [b]crew needs money to develop.[/b] WHY? Isn't this what their work is based on anyway? Aren't they already getting paid to work on what they were working on before? You guys are assuming they did H2H for free? You must be idiotic to think this way. It boggles my mind. If you're too stupid to understand: 1. Crew pays whatever money they pay to Marcus. 2. REMOVED - JBW 3. SIM changes. No extra money. Extra money would be necessary if they were to get someone other than Marcus, which wouldn't be a bad thing. So unless I wasn't informed by Patrick, that they need money and you were, my bad. Edited to remove personal remarks on crew -JBW1 thing I don't understand. These people who are arguing that the crew needs money to develop. WHY? Isn't this what their work is based on anyway? Aren't they already getting paid to work on what they were working on before? You guys are assuming they did H2H for free? You must be idiotic to think this way. It boggles my mind. If you're too stupid to understand:

1. Crew pays whatever money they pay to Marcus.
2. REMOVED - JBW
3. SIM changes.

No extra money. Extra money would be necessary if they were to get someone other than Marcus, which wouldn't be a bad thing. So unless I wasn't informed by Patrick, that they need money and you were, my bad.

Edited to remove personal remarks on crew -JBW

Edited: 26-06-2011 08:53
Total edits: 2

Re: MZ's downfall

By shayno - 24-06-2011 18:36

There is no sense of community anymore, Very little engagement for the manager and the sim doesn't help.There is no sense of community anymore, Very little engagement for the manager and the sim doesn't help.

Re: MZ's downfall

By deleted_480980 - 24-06-2011 19:22

Regardless of user churn or defection, I think the company behind the game could be doing a bit more to make it visible on the web. For example, a Google search for 'football manager game' puts MZ at the bottom of the second page on google.co.uk. Looking at what's above it I would have thought a tweak here and there would boost the ranking pretty easily.Regardless of user churn or defection, I think the company behind the game could be doing a bit more to make it visible on the web.

For example, a Google search for 'football manager game' puts MZ at the bottom of the second page on google.co.uk. Looking at what's above it I would have thought a tweak here and there would boost the ranking pretty easily.

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 24-06-2011 20:57

[WCE]
President

If everyone who have something bad to say about MZ would quit, there would be approxomately 10% users left. And there would be even less chance of anything happening, development wise. Changes in the past, expecially when it came to communication, was because of people complaining. Both Dolphin and Cattleyard was hired as a direct result of people saying enough is enough. Me "whining" is me being optimistic, because I think there is hope, I think that if Crew just start to listen, then this game can see glory again. As other "nay sayers" say, this game has heaps of potential. I remember me sitting at work talking MZ tactics with my boss during lunch break. He had come up with a killer tactic, I stole it, re-adjusted it, but he still didnt fire my ass. And outside of MZ I was his boss, as I was MA and he was GA. I might be one of the very few people on MZ having landed a job because of MZ.. And other times having a beer together with friends while playing MZ, and then of course going out and being slightly less nerdy about things. Basically all the good guys from back then are gone, or have gone semi-inactive. I have no intention to quit. I might sell my team, and go semi-inactive again. I have seen Crew members come and go, and chances are I might still be around when next Crew team is assembled. As Jaime wrote above, MZ is a wounded animal, it can still be healed. @moffdacoach: I said goodbye as an assistant two month ago, and was on the brinch of selling my team. I decided to keep my team and throw my red letters. I hope that answers your question. @UP: I agree and disagree. They could do a lot more, sure. But at the same time, this game has some fundemental flaws that should be dealt with prior to any campaigns being run. I doubt I would have stuck around if I had been a new user today. The community is pretty much dead, so is the transfermarket as a result of that. And add to that the inconsistant results, even for new teams. If users are very happy with this game, they will automatically invite their friends, relatives and aquantainces. Add some advertisement on top of that, and voila.If everyone who have something bad to say about MZ would quit, there would be approxomately 10% users left. And there would be even less chance of anything happening, development wise. Changes in the past, expecially when it came to communication, was because of people complaining. Both Dolphin and Cattleyard was hired as a direct result of people saying enough is enough.

Me "whining" is me being optimistic, because I think there is hope, I think that if Crew just start to listen, then this game can see glory again. As other "nay sayers" say, this game has heaps of potential. I remember me sitting at work talking MZ tactics with my boss during lunch break. He had come up with a killer tactic, I stole it, re-adjusted it, but he still didnt fire my ass. And outside of MZ I was his boss, as I was MA and he was GA. I might be one of the very few people on MZ having landed a job because of MZ.. And other times having a beer together with friends while playing MZ, and then of course going out and being slightly less nerdy about things. Basically all the good guys from back then are gone, or have gone semi-inactive.

I have no intention to quit. I might sell my team, and go semi-inactive again. I have seen Crew members come and go, and chances are I might still be around when next Crew team is assembled. As Jaime wrote above, MZ is a wounded animal, it can still be healed.

@moffdacoach:
I said goodbye as an assistant two month ago, and was on the brinch of selling my team. I decided to keep my team and throw my red letters. I hope that answers your question.

@UP:
I agree and disagree. They could do a lot more, sure. But at the same time, this game has some fundemental flaws that should be dealt with prior to any campaigns being run. I doubt I would have stuck around if I had been a new user today. The community is pretty much dead, so is the transfermarket as a result of that. And add to that the inconsistant results, even for new teams. If users are very happy with this game, they will automatically invite their friends, relatives and aquantainces. Add some advertisement on top of that, and voila.

Re: MZ's downfall

By romanasu - 25-06-2011 14:44

[MZ]

The game is more more a commercial game. A commercial game it's less popular than a free one. I'm curious who are the new users ? They are middle aged (working) people with some money and little free time or children/students with no money but lots of free time ? Also, MZ is no click game, it requires patience and lots of time before you make a visible progress. As in all games, people get bored and quit the game. Especially in MZ, where, half of users loose matches and only half wins. If the number of active people is constantly going down, the company will risk bankruptcy. The game requires a constant flux of incoming people, otherwise, it would go down. The think i hate most it's that you can buy MZ money for real money. I made a test: my football team doesn't play in cups/fl. I make 299k euro every week, in the top division. My hockey team is also in the top division. i played in 4-5 payed cups - less than one third of the total number of cups (and in no fl's). In some weeks i have 350k, in others 450k. At football team i have to constantly sell players in order to avoid bankruptcy; at hockey, i have lots of money and i can afford a big team with lots of players. So, with real money you can buy MZ money; the quantity is limited, but it's enough to make an unfair advantage. I think MZ/PowerSoccer company had some big troubles in the last 1-2 years; there were lots of people leaving the company (maybe, even key employees, who build the game), and, the new one, probably need time to understand the system. They probably have troubles keeping the company alive. Servers are expensive and the number of active users is dropping down; so, probably there are less money for the company. They need to find new ways of making money. Head2Head it's nice feature; they have the know-how from power-soccer and integrated it in MZ. I'm not sure they are going to make too much money with it. This strategy it's a better one than other "great" ideas in the past: double or triple the number of payd competitions. P.S. Sorry for the long and boring message.The game is more more a commercial game. A commercial game it's less popular than a free one.
I'm curious who are the new users ? They are middle aged (working) people with some money and little free time or children/students with no money but lots of free time ?
Also, MZ is no click game, it requires patience and lots of time before you make a visible progress.
As in all games, people get bored and quit the game. Especially in MZ, where, half of users loose matches and only half wins. If the number of active people is constantly going down, the company will risk bankruptcy. The game requires a constant flux of incoming people, otherwise, it would go down.

The think i hate most it's that you can buy MZ money for real money. I made a test: my football team doesn't play in cups/fl. I make 299k euro every week, in the top division. My hockey team is also in the top division. i played in 4-5 payed cups - less than one third of the total number of cups (and in no fl's). In some weeks i have 350k, in others 450k. At football team i have to constantly sell players in order to avoid bankruptcy; at hockey, i have lots of money and i can afford a big team with lots of players. So, with real money you can buy MZ money; the quantity is limited, but it's enough to make an unfair advantage.

I think MZ/PowerSoccer company had some big troubles in the last 1-2 years; there were lots of people leaving the company (maybe, even key employees, who build the game), and, the new one, probably need time to understand the system. They probably have troubles keeping the company alive. Servers are expensive and the number of active users is dropping down; so, probably there are less money for the company. They need to find new ways of making money. Head2Head it's nice feature; they have the know-how from power-soccer and integrated it in MZ. I'm not sure they are going to make too much money with it. This strategy it's a better one than other "great" ideas in the past: double or triple the number of payd competitions.

P.S. Sorry for the long and boring message.

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 25-06-2011 15:36

[WCE]
President

Most of the Crew members that was with the company some years ago are gone yes, and it is basically a new Crew team now. That is why I think it is vital that they improve on communication, and listen to their customers. We know this game more than they do, as they don't even play this game actively. Patrick7777 lost his team due to inactivity or bankrupcy, and had to start over with a new team recently. Good thing is that Marcus is back in the company though. That will probably mean the next simulator will be a significant improvement upon the one we have now. But I don't think they realize how financial rewarding it would be for them if they actually repaired/improved the simulator, because we have basically had the same simulator since 2008 now. Yes, they need to make more money, and I think it is ok that you to atleast some degree gain advantages by spending money joining cups etc. If that was not the case, they would make even less money. However, H2H as a standalone product will most likely not generate much income, as it is based on the same simulator that has been the cause for the mass exodus of users. And it is after all just a "minigame" within the game itself. Your message is far from boring by the way, allthough I disagree with some elements ;) Thanks for your input.Most of the Crew members that was with the company some years ago are gone yes, and it is basically a new Crew team now. That is why I think it is vital that they improve on communication, and listen to their customers. We know this game more than they do, as they don't even play this game actively. Patrick7777 lost his team due to inactivity or bankrupcy, and had to start over with a new team recently.

Good thing is that Marcus is back in the company though. That will probably mean the next simulator will be a significant improvement upon the one we have now. But I don't think they realize how financial rewarding it would be for them if they actually repaired/improved the simulator, because we have basically had the same simulator since 2008 now.

Yes, they need to make more money, and I think it is ok that you to atleast some degree gain advantages by spending money joining cups etc. If that was not the case, they would make even less money. However, H2H as a standalone product will most likely not generate much income, as it is based on the same simulator that has been the cause for the mass exodus of users. And it is after all just a "minigame" within the game itself.

Your message is far from boring by the way, allthough I disagree with some elements ;) Thanks for your input.

Re: MZ's downfall

By aarons - 26-06-2011 04:40

[MZ]

I waZ playing a lot of friendly leagues/cups but stopped because after a certain number of leagues/cups there is no financial benefit for my team. I was happy playN shed loadZ of games, spending lots of money but why waste that money for nothing ? Its a load of BS Therefore my conclusion is crew do not want to make money.I waZ playing a lot of friendly leagues/cups but stopped because after a certain number of leagues/cups there is no financial benefit for my team. I was happy playN shed loadZ of games, spending lots of money but why waste that money for nothing ? Its a load of BS

Therefore my conclusion is crew do not want to make money.

Re: MZ's downfall

By kingjaime - 26-06-2011 13:16

[BVB]

It's an interesting footnote to the drop in active members, to consider whether those who've stayed active are necessarily putting in the money they used to. I haven't entered a cup in a year or so, no FLs, no player items (despite the huge temptation), let alone Club Membership. At least 3 cup entries per season, countless FL entries, and constant Club Membership were pretty consistent up to 12-18 months or so ago. I suppose Crew would know better than anyone if revenues have dropped much, and if so no doubt they're feverishly working away "If only we could design one really killer player item they'll all buy..." ;-DIt's an interesting footnote to the drop in active members, to consider whether those who've stayed active are necessarily putting in the money they used to. I haven't entered a cup in a year or so, no FLs, no player items (despite the huge temptation), let alone Club Membership. At least 3 cup entries per season, countless FL entries, and constant Club Membership were pretty consistent up to 12-18 months or so ago. I suppose Crew would know better than anyone if revenues have dropped much, and if so no doubt they're feverishly working away "If only we could design one really killer player item they'll all buy..." ;-D

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 27-06-2011 00:31

[WCE]
President

That is true, quite a few active teams just in Norway alone, have gone from being big spenders to just sit idle and wait for the game to be improved. They are only playing friendlies just like you Jaime. Many of them used to be a real gem to the community and the game by working as assistants. I think that the longer you have played this game, the more you can compare with , and ultimately the more dissapointed you will be with the current situation, generally speaking. I am pretty sure the massive increase in number of cups these last season is a way to compensate for the decrease in revenue. Crew also raised the cost of tokens in 2010.That is true, quite a few active teams just in Norway alone, have gone from being big spenders to just sit idle and wait for the game to be improved. They are only playing friendlies just like you Jaime. Many of them used to be a real gem to the community and the game by working as assistants. I think that the longer you have played this game, the more you can compare with , and ultimately the more dissapointed you will be with the current situation, generally speaking.

I am pretty sure the massive increase in number of cups these last season is a way to compensate for the decrease in revenue. Crew also raised the cost of tokens in 2010.

Re: MZ's downfall

By jaysargey - 27-06-2011 00:32

and the cost of CM not long before thatand the cost of CM not long before that

Re: MZ's downfall

By thaifoon - 28-06-2011 08:25

I am looking for a new game to play and I came to MZ a few months ago to see what it is like. I did not feel it was intuitive and I did not stay long. I received the H2H email advert and decided to come and try again. I think many multi-user games have a lot of potential. However, because they need a lot of time and dedication as an investment, you need a sim which is fairly realistic and reliable. Of course, you don't mind strange results from time to time as they happen in real life too. But you need to know that you are progressing, otherwise the game becomes pointless. I will give it a longer go this time, but I will have an eye on the issues here!I am looking for a new game to play and I came to MZ a few months ago to see what it is like. I did not feel it was intuitive and I did not stay long. I received the H2H email advert and decided to come and try again.

I think many multi-user games have a lot of potential. However, because they need a lot of time and dedication as an investment, you need a sim which is fairly realistic and reliable. Of course, you don't mind strange results from time to time as they happen in real life too. But you need to know that you are progressing, otherwise the game becomes pointless. I will give it a longer go this time, but I will have an eye on the issues here!

Re: MZ's downfall

By mity16 - 28-06-2011 10:30

When I hear the expresion "exciting game" I feel that I have to piuk. This big random is made on purpose for " excitement ". Why isn`t here a 'Hall of Fame" to see the winners of championship`s and the winner of the most important cups? R: because this doesn`t bring money. But the amount of the cups bring money, they are so many cups but whith no value (prestige) anymore. So because of this the players don`t have motivation to stay in the game to win them anymore. This game will keep falling and I am very hapy because of this :D.When I hear the expresion "exciting game" I feel that I have to piuk.
This big random is made on purpose for " excitement ".

Why isn`t here a 'Hall of Fame" to see the winners of championship`s and the winner of the most important cups?
R: because this doesn`t bring money.

But the amount of the cups bring money, they are so many cups but whith no value (prestige) anymore. So because of this the players don`t have motivation to stay in the game to win them anymore.

This game will keep falling and I am very hapy because of this :D.

Re: MZ's downfall

By mity16 - 28-06-2011 10:31

I don`t mentioned about the SIM because i feel again that I have to piuk :PI don`t mentioned about the SIM because i feel again that I have to piuk :P

Re: MZ's downfall

By civilu - 28-06-2011 22:21

[RAF]
President

I could resume this to what it was actually caused by: - not working on the things which have a more acute priority in this game; - losing touch with the communities (communication towards zero). The rest are just effects, which we see every day getting worst. And the downfall will continue, in my opinion, as long as the two above aspects are not given priority zero and minus one. I really hope for the best but I always prepare for the worst! [i]At least I won my season 18 cup, as I have been dreaming since the very beginning!I could resume this to what it was actually caused by:

- not working on the things which have a more acute priority in this game;
- losing touch with the communities (communication towards zero).

The rest are just effects, which we see every day getting worst. And the downfall will continue, in my opinion, as long as the two above aspects are not given priority zero and minus one.

I really hope for the best but I always prepare for the worst! At least I won my season 18 cup, as I have been dreaming since the very beginning!

Re: MZ's downfall

By hanzinho - 28-06-2011 23:03

[WCE]
President

Great to see a rookie posting in here, no, not you Civ ;) I agree with you thaifoon regarding the simulator and that it needs to be reliable and fair in a game like this. Crew don't seem to understand the mentality of the common virtual manager out there, when they could put so much element of random in the simulator, and even increase it earlier this year. Perhaps it was a trick to try to catch new users, but failing to see that even new users will lose matches they shouldn't, to inactive teams for example. That is how the superboost works. Lets hope the next simulator will put more emphasis on tactics and skills, instead of random/luck.Great to see a rookie posting in here, no, not you Civ ;)

I agree with you thaifoon regarding the simulator and that it needs to be reliable and fair in a game like this. Crew don't seem to understand the mentality of the common virtual manager out there, when they could put so much element of random in the simulator, and even increase it earlier this year. Perhaps it was a trick to try to catch new users, but failing to see that even new users will lose matches they shouldn't, to inactive teams for example. That is how the superboost works.

Lets hope the next simulator will put more emphasis on tactics and skills, instead of random/luck.

Re: MZ's downfall

By thaifoon - 29-06-2011 05:16

I think one of the problems of these sorts of games is that the longer you have been in the game, the more chance you have of being near the top and the more difficult it is to be dislodged by newcomers. But increasing random to help the lesser teams is not the answer. You have to have a good sim that rewards hard work, dedication and skill. As I said before, no problem with the odd funny result, but it should not be the norm. To be fair, it is a difficult balance. How do you motivate and keep top teams interested and have a good chance of maintaining their position as well as giving sufficient encouragement and opportunity for advancement of new teams?I think one of the problems of these sorts of games is that the longer you have been in the game, the more chance you have of being near the top and the more difficult it is to be dislodged by newcomers. But increasing random to help the lesser teams is not the answer. You have to have a good sim that rewards hard work, dedication and skill. As I said before, no problem with the odd funny result, but it should not be the norm.

To be fair, it is a difficult balance. How do you motivate and keep top teams interested and have a good chance of maintaining their position as well as giving sufficient encouragement and opportunity for advancement of new teams?

Re: MZ's downfall

By kacino - 29-06-2011 18:41

[MIC]

i hear about this, and i decide to join again to look what happen here exactly... sad to hear much nice people i know was leaving...i hear about this, and i decide to join again to look what happen here exactly...
sad to hear much nice people i know was leaving...

 

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